Boycott ncb email
I saw this story on the Star website “Boycott email targets National Commercial Bank (NCB)” and could barely contain my excitement. I hate what they are doing to alternative investment clubs in Jamaica. They are apart of the lynching party that hounded, wounded and slaughtered cash plus, Olint , World Wise, Warner Higgins. An NCB official was quoted that they will have to “manage and counteract this.”
I hear defense and damage control.
I can see more commercials on television with beautiful coastal hotels and children playing in the fields and pleasant NCB rep smiling with a customer. “building a better Jamaica” FOR THEMSELVES.
I haven’t seen the email but I would love to get it forwarded to me so that I can add my own bad experiences with them. According to the news story it is a viral email that is forwarded with each recipient adding their own story with the bank.
Citizen journalism is the wave of the future where blogs, online forums and viral email will help fight the greedy selfish status quo. I am glad to see Jamaicans making use of this and catching on to a world wide trend. National Commercial Bank reported increase profits first quarter ended December 31, 2007 to a staggering 24 %. Yes 24 % is staggering.
“For the quarter, the bank recorded net profit of $1.86 billion or 76 cents per share culled from improved revenues of $5.6 billion; compared to $1.5 billion or 61 cents per share from revenues of $5.2 billion in the year prior period.” Read story at Jamaica Gleaner
If they can do this well when alternative investment clubs were alive and kicking, then now that they are on life support NCB must be a wash with cash in their next quarter. Many Jamaicans were seeing their hopes and dreams come through thanks to the alternative investment clubs. While NCB trample on the dreams of ordinary folks they continue to make record profits quarter after quarter.
I did wrote about this a couple months ago that just like cable and wireless , NCB will turn a generational resentment against them that no amount of charity and PR spin can change. I just wish my pay didn’t go them. I will do my part in boycotting them in all other business opting for Scotia which is like their evil twin, but what can a guy do.
Kingston State Of Mind 
I too received an interesting email regarding the alternative investment schemes. It is important for us to review this ‘saga’ from all possible angles; how else do we learn from our experiences? I have pasted the e-mail below for all interested persons to review and digest. I encourage all to read and be empowered by knowledge…things are not always as they appear on the surface…the sooner we acknowledge this is the sooner we can move on…I for one shall not be taken for a ride again! Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice….
“We need to know the facts. Have we taken the time to look truly at what is happening or are we being fed half truths and ignoring other blatant questions that the alternative investment schemes have yet to answer?
Interested members of the public who really want to know what has happened in this matter with NCB / Cash Plus / Olint should go to the Court of Appeal like I did and pay your $100 to get a copy of the documents that have been filed – it is all there for you to read and understand. You would be amazed at the different picture that it gives in comparison to what you hear on the street! For example, you will see that NCB did take quite a while before deciding to close these accounts because dialogue was taking place with the account holders and the Bank was given certain verbal assurances that their requests for additional information like audited financial statements would be fulfilled. There are several letters on file in the courts that attest to this. Up to now these financial statements can’t be produced. That is worrying.
One major question to be answered therefore is why are they resisting simple compliance by providing audited financial statements to their bankers? What do they have to hide if their business is legitimate? Is it that they do not wish to disclose their financial statements as a way to avoid payment of taxes? And if so, how can a Bank knowingly do business with tax dodgers? It is hypocritical for one to put all the blame at the feet of the bank. These entities want to continue doing business and offer superior returns to us? Then what is the big deal about letting the bank have information to satisfy its own regulators? They should be made to answer for their irresponsible and questionable actions.
Since NCB was making so much money from operating the accounts of these entities, then what could be the reason behind wanting to stop the inflows? Clearly, it is more risky to continue banking them without the requisite information on file and we as members of the public need to think about that more deeply. Don’t underestimate the behind the scene pressure from government/BOJ when you consider that there are no withholding tax revenues being collected from the interest we get from these clubs. It would make no sense for NCB to stop doing profitable business with a customer unless there was some greater threat being faced.
One woman according to The Star newspaper sold her house in Greater Portmore for $1.2M and put it in Cash Plus last year – she can’t get it back and it had nothing to do with the announcement of any bank account that was going to be closed. We should all know as a fact that if you have money in your account and you give someone a cheque to cash, the Bank CANNOT REFUSE TO CASH IT BECAUSE OF INSUFFICIENT FUNDS!! Some of us might have had our bank mistakenly bounce a cheque when we did indeed have the money in our account and what did the Bank have to do? Immediately issue a letter of apology to the payee or face legal action from us! There is only one frightening reason why the persons with their Cash Plus cheques couldn’t get them cashed!
Thousands of us know that these operations are not sustainable and are not generating real value – we know and we don’t care, as long as we are getting our monthly returns, then anyone or any entity that possibly threatens that must take the blame. It doesn’t matter when we consider that all that is happening is we are making our returns off the hard earned savings of another Jamaican that was duped or silly enough to try to get in “the action” after we did. They use their new money that comes in to pay those of us who were in for a longer time. Didn’t you realize that the first thing Cash Plus did when public scare started from the pending closure of the accounts was to announce a brand new referral scheme? Text messages and advts were being sent left right and centre asking persons to refer others with cash and you could win weekends for two and overseas trips!!!
Let’s face that truth about this and stop trying to put the blame squarely elsewhere. Many of us are quite embarrassed now to know that it is very high risk and our money can be lost – there are some who can do without that money because we only gambled what we could afford to lose, there are others who are not so fortunate and that fallout is indeed serious.
Ask your AIS for answers! If they can’t provide them take out your money – put it under your mattress if you don’t trust the Banks but don’t be fooled – take a stand!!” – anonymous
Once bitten—-
You obviously have in depth knowledge and I respect that. You arguments are reasonable and silted in the banks favor. I am guessing you work in the industry.
Some of what you said is pure speculating although still plausible, for example a new referral system cash plus introduced when they came under pressure. Any business who is at risk at being wiped out will try to survive.All business “spruce” up things if the out look is uncertain or shaky.
I am not at all sympathetic to that woman in Greater Portmore you eluded to. I think anyone who would sell their home to invest in an investment club is a blasted fool. There is a saying I can not remember right now about a fool and his/her money parting.
Boj and other agencies wanting documentation about these clubs is understandable. I can understand that pressure. I just wonder why didn’t other banks who did business with these clubs didn’t fight as aggressively as NCB. Was that bank pressured more than others. If this was the case NCB should have done a better job arguing this point in media. “Blame it on the government card”.
I don’t buy your argument about NCB making all this money from investment clubs. I think and it was clear that the banks were losing more than they were gaining. If the woman in greater Portmore would sell her house to give to cash plus then just imagine how horrified NCB must have been when people started cleaning out their bank accounts to give it to cash plus. You trying to say that the bank benefited from investment clubs is crazy.
If NCB has less of my savings to lend to other folks at humongous interest rates then that affects the bottom line if even vaguely.
I can agree with you that everyone can not just get up and do what they want even with their own money because the banking/money/economy system is intricately connected and if one catches a cold then we can have domino effect that hurts everyone.
Once bitten—-
You obviously have in depth knowledge and I respect that. You arguments are reasonable and tilted in the banks favor. I am guessing you work in the industry.
Some of what you said is pure speculating although still plausible, for example a new referral system cash plus introduced when they came under pressure. Any business who is at risk at being wiped out will try to survive.All business “spruce” up things if the out look is uncertain or shaky.
I am not at all sympathetic to that woman in Greater Portmore you eluded to. I think anyone who would sell their home to invest in an investment club is a blasted fool. There is a saying I can not remember right now about a fool and his/her money parting.
Boj and other agencies wanting documentation about these clubs is understandable. I can understand that pressure. I just wonder why didn’t other banks who did business with these clubs didn’t fight as aggressively as NCB. Was that bank pressured more than others. If this was the case NCB should have done a better job arguing this point in media. “Blame it on the government card”.
I don’t buy your argument about NCB making all this money from investment clubs. I think and it was clear that the banks were losing more than they were gaining. If the woman in greater Portmore would sell her house to give to cash plus then just imagine how horrified NCB must have been when people started cleaning out their bank accounts to give it to cash plus. You trying to say that the bank benefited from investment clubs is crazy.
If NCB has less of my savings to lend to other folks at humongous interest rates then that affects the bottom line if even vaguely.
I can agree with you that everyone can not just get up and do what they want even with their own money because the banking/money/economy system is intricately connected and if one catches a cold then we can have domino effect that hurts everyone.
Dutty Bwoy,
I take all your points and know, as well as you must, that we will agree to disagree on several of them. However, I do want to make a few points:
1) I did not write the e-mail, it was forwarded to me. I posted it to add balance to the debate
2)Other banks DID close their account. If persons would follow the news carefully and without bias to the sensational elements, they would recall that NCB’s lawyer(can’t recall his name right now) came on TV and posed the question to the AISs asking why it is that NCB is the only one being taken to court when there were other Banks (BNS, First Global an others) mentioned regarding closures. I have a theory: NCB is being used to set a precedence. The laws that govern NCB govern every bank operating lawfuly in Jamaica. If NCB is allowed to close its accounts, they fear that no other bank will bank them…which would be the case due to the risk that banks expose themselves to by knowingly banking a ‘suspicous’ company. If they win, hence the fervent appeals, they could take that victory to the other banks who have closed and threaten to close their accounts and use it as a bsis to remain open.
3) I think you should purchase those court documents…the truth reads stranger than fiction. The take from Peter to pay Paul method that Cash Plus used is heart wrenching. I use such an emotive term as I can imagine a man who put his life savings or retirement fund into cash plus, oblivious to the method by which it was being invested (which seems as if it wasn’t being invested at all) so that another man can buy a Range Rover. It is a vicious cycle.
4) These schemes only work for the people who get in early and leave early. It is not a new concept, it has been done and done! I invite you to tune in to American Greed. It is a programme on CNBC. There is one particular episode called “Hook Line and Sucker” and it is Cash Plus to the letter. We are outraged because this is new to us, but the fact is people like this go around taking advantage of people all over the world.
5) Schemes like these need the banks. Try to visualize this: You give money to Scheme A. I have already invested in Scheme A and am ready to make a withdrawal. In order for Scheme A – who has no real productive form of staying liquid and generating funds – to pay me, it needs access to the uncleared funds that YOU lodged to make me happy. That is where the banks come in. With the termination of the relationship that they used to enjoy with the banks, Scheme A no longer has access to uncleared funds and now has to GOD FORBID actually have its own money that it should have been generating through all of the fabulous investments it “said” it was involved in available to pay persons when they are prepared to withdraw. That was the dilema and that was why the clutched on to NCB with all their might as the lack of what was essentially NCB’s money (as the funds were not yet cleared) was driving them out of business. As i said “take from Peter to Pay Paul.”
6)OLINT and Cashplus are not one in the same. I would never accuse Olint of doing this. I am actually a fan of David Smith. But the same rules apply, you have to furnish banks with basic documents if you want to be a customer. I have to! i Don’t think there is much supsicion around whetehr or not Olint is ligitimately making money, I think they just don’t want to pay the 25% tax…I wouldn’t either…25% on billions is a lot of money. But do i think it’s worth foregoing the convenience of being compliant and being able to bank anywhere in Jamaica I want to, and pasing that convenience on to my customers, nope. I say pay the 25% and take it off our cut…most people won’t mind, it’s still an astonishing return on investment.
7) Finally, if NCB is the only villain, why is it that Cash Plus and Olint don’t just close their accounts and bank somewhere else? The answer is simple, no one else wants to bank them. So then why are we only mad at NCB , why aren’t we mad at every bank that won’t stand up and stay “Here Cash Plus, here Olint, come on over, i’ll take your money!” Why aren’t we thinking of these things? Why do we choose to jump on this bandwagon of ignorance that teaches us nothing but to blame others for our own bad judgement? Why aren’t we asking ALL the other Banks to save us from NCB and take the money so that these AISs can get on with the busines of making us money if that is a possibility? No one has been able to answer me thus far, and believe me I have been in the minority on this debate since the beginning so i have been asking the questions. The other banks are sitting back becasue they are terrfied of speaking up; look at the backlash NCB is receiving, they would never call this down on themselves. That is why you only hear about NCB, because the other banks are thrilled that a light hasn’t been cast on them and their closures AND their policies which mirror NCBs. They are waiting for this to die a natural death and for them it’s business as usual while people plot to boycott NCB when BNS and company are doing the same thing but it’s just not in the main stream news…you see, this type of thing doesn’t selll newspapers. You need one main villain (it doesn’t argur well to cast the net too wide), it’s the blueprint for every good screenplay!
Money is a very emotional topic, so common sense and reasoning are not the order of the day when discussing the perception of ‘food’ being boxed from our mouths. But when we have some time to calm down and reflect on all the evidence before us I hope we can all ask the question “Who is really to be blamed?” and i hope that at that time we come up with a more reasonable response.
Once bitten
You made some great points , much of what you say is true and make a lot of sense. What I find especially interesting is that all the banks have done the same think as NCB but only they are targeted. That point is very solid,however I don’t think it is unfair to go after one. In many ways they have taken the lead in all of this. I am not sure but isn’t an NCB exec the president of the bankers association of Jamaica. NCB took the lean in publicity in press conferences in this battle between AISs and status quo. Maybe they would not be taking so much of the heat now if they played a more sutle role like the other. I remember one evening when all the banks conspire to close cash plus accounts all in synergy to have a run on the organization. I don’t know if playing public or low key would have made much difference. My point is that they take the heat because they lead the charge publicly to hurt AISs.
The pyramid scheme you explained is well known and if you remember a few years ago many of there popped up in western Jamaica and all collapsed for all the obvious reasons. I will admit that some of Cash Plus remarkable returns couls lead many of us to speculate that they are running a pyramid scheme. I use the word speculate because I don’t know for sure. I don’t know if you can say for certain that it was a pyramid scheme, you are guessing. I did not read those court papers you talk about. maybe they explain you reasoning on this point.
The very reason the banks especially NCB closed cash plus account is because many of their business was “shady and “suspicious”. These are both words you use. This further explain my point of speculating about them being a pyramid scheme because you are not certain, no even NCB which is one of thier reasons for closing the accounts.
On the point of Olint and others who trade currencies, there business operations are very transparent. They were hang-out to dry any way by the banks. Olint does they very same thing that brokerage and banks themselves do. I agree with you that the playing field should be level for all players. If the banks have to pay 25% tax then AISs should play the same game.
Dutty Bwoy,
I agree that much of what is being debated is speculation, but I know you will agree that all we are left to do is speculate because none of these comapanies have proven their source of funds which is a requirement so that the banks can prove to their regulators that they know for a fact that their customers are doing what they say they are doing.
You say you remember one evening when the banks conspired to close the AISs; in all fairness, isn’t that also speculation? There has been no evidence of this, and frankly the stringent laws placed upon the industry by the FSC would prohibit the likelihood of this actually ever happening.
NCB didn’t willingly take the lead in publicity, i think they were used as the sacrificial lamb and thrust into the limelight. I think the fact that their senior official is the president of the JBA made them an easy target; kill 2 birds with one stone. I have never seen them gloat or appear arrogant about the situation. As a matter of fact, they refused to comment on several instances, as reported by the press, because the court case was pending and they couldn’t discuss it. And the media showed no interest in any other banks; which i’m sure the other banks are please about, as who wants bad press?
Cash Plus on the other hand went into spin overload! Carlos Hill dressed in an all white suit (I’m sure the symbolismm of that didn’t pass you unnoticed) ‘preaching’ to his ‘congregation’ like the messiah who was here to save the poor people of Jamaica, bragging about his holdings (most of which have not been paid for and are now in foreclosure). It was so staged and so fake, it was in that moment that i felt really terrified for the Jamaicans who had invested their last with them. I knew then that this 3-card man/used car dealer fast talking approach was that of a desparate man and a failing company. I actualy expected him to leave the country shortly thereafter…he surprised me and stayed…but where is he now? Where is Carlos Hill? His companies are locking up shop. This cannot be the result of the closure of bank accounts; just open another one somewhere else and keep it moving…if your business is legitimate productivity should not stop. Don’t you agree? Why was he so vocal, doing interviews on CVM and TVJ almost every night, and now he’s MIA. Why aren’t people asking these pertinent questions? Where is Carlos Hill?
I think it is clear what OLINT is doing, I believe they trade currecies, but i can understand and respect that the banks can’t just take their word for it….they need documents. OLINT has not provided this and that is the reason for the closure. I think they should just get regulated, pay the 25%, and take it off the investors cut…no one would mind. It’s still a huge profit.
I used the term suspicious because i have it on good authority that that is the term that is used when persons or companies do not furnish banks with the requisite information, i believe it stems from the act itself being suspicious.
When all is said and done, I hope OLINT does find a way to appease the local regulators and keep its accounts open as it would make a world of difference regarding convenience for the company and its customers. And i hope that CashPlus can somehow find a way to pay back these investors and try their hand at another business.
It’s been great talking to you. It’s nice to have intellectual debates with open minded people; even if at the end of the day, we have to agree to disagree.
*Just a point to note before I go. Are you aware that NCB was sued by the FSC last year and threatened with closure because they failed to report a transaction that was a few thousand US$ in excess of the authorized threshold? Because they couldn’t prove the source of those funds, and did not report it on time, NCB could have been closed last year (It was a big scandal in February, you must remember it). The FSC is serious, and persons need to consider this when they think banks are acting like regulators and bullies. The fact of the matter is, they are protecting themselves, as they should. It’s a publicly traded comapny. If people think the downfall of Cash Plus is far reaching, what do they think the demise of National Commercial Bank, that has served Jamaica for 171 years and whose investor base makes Cash Plus look like a partner draw would do to our economy and the society in general?
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thank you for your interest in my blog.
You need to get your facts straight Olints does not operates i Jamaica and is a legal entitiy in the Turks and Cakus.
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